Rudy Von Berg: Ironman World Championship Podium, Training Protocols, Sponsorships, and Citizen of the World
Alright. In the studio today is professional triathlete, Rudy Von Berg. He just got back a couple days ago from his 3rd place at the Ironman World Championships in Kona. It was really good to catch up with Rudy. I've known him for a long time.
Justin Metzler:We're both Boulder guys and have been racing each other since college. So I've been following his career, pretty closely, and it was great to ask him some specific questions about how he got to where he is today. We talk about some of the coaches that he's had, some of the training approaches that have worked, some of the things that haven't worked. We talk about his mindset and his mental approach to training, and we also dive a little bit into some of the sponsorship, pieces that add to his puzzle and, the new equipment that he was riding in Kona just a couple days ago. So enjoy this conversation with Rudy Vonberg.
Justin Metzler:Alright. Welcome to another episode of Endurance Matters. I'm your host, Justin Metzler. Hot off the heels of his 3rd place in Kona in the studio today, the bison, Rudy Vonberg. Rudy, welcome to the studio.
Rudy Von Berg:Thanks for having me, Justin. Good to good to talk.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Absolutely. I've known Rudy. How long have we known each other? Over 10 years.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. My earliest memories are, what, collegiate races or, like, I remember that Memphis in May. Oh, yes. Yeah. It was 2014, 2015.
Rudy Von Berg:Was
Justin Metzler:that your rookie season? 2014?
Rudy Von Berg:Or did you I don't really know when would be my rookie season because I was racing ITU Yeah. Which is somewhat Sure. Considered pro. So, you know, I don't know when is the real yeah.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. I think we must have raced we definitely raced in, Tempe for Collegiate Nationals. And then did you ever do Tuscaloosa Collegiate Nationals?
Rudy Von Berg:And I did Clemson.
Justin Metzler:I didn't do that one.
Rudy Von Berg:And I did 2 years in Tempe and one year in Clemson. Okay.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. So, anyways, we go back to, like, 2012 or something. So been racing each other, and training together a little bit for a long time. I start the podcast off with a hard hitting question. Oh.
Justin Metzler:You ready? Would you rather physically become a bison, but never be able to do triathlon again or be able to win Kona, but in exchange, bison have to become extinct?
Rudy Von Berg:Oh, Yeah. I'd I'd still go for Wincona.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. I know. Sorry, bison.
Rudy Von Berg:But no one wants a bison extinct.
Justin Metzler:I know. I
Rudy Von Berg:know. Such a cool animal.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. I guess, like, tell people a little bit about the bison. What's up with the bison? You are the bison now? Like, how'd that come about?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I mean, just as a kid, really, I was fascinated by the animal. And I was that's when I was growing up in France. And, even I would get some presents, you know, from my parents of, like, this, this bronze bison and, like so I was already into it. And then, I applied to CU Boulder and that was the only university I applied to.
Rudy Von Berg:And so CU is the CU Buffs. So then after a few years there, I was like, okay, I'm a bit onto something. And then started kinda Googling just, character traits or, you know, what how bison are and then how they head into the storm. And then I would start talking with my friends a bit about, you know, if they're not training in the winter because I'm always used to going out in the winter when it's really cold or snowing or whatever. And so I would kinda start doing it like that, seeing them they're not a real bison.
Rudy Von Berg:And so it kinda, yeah, start getting into the character a little. And so then, yeah, it just kinda naturally progressed a little, and so I started using it around races and things like that. So, yeah, I think it's a it's a bit of a fun thing, and people can remember me a bit easier too. It's a bit marketing too, you know?
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Absolutely. No. It's cool. I mean, you're definitely like I feel like the last couple of years, the bison's really picked up some steam.
Justin Metzler:Maybe that's, like, correlate to your race results, but you are the bison now.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah.
Justin Metzler:I wanna back it up a little bit. Talk to me a little bit about, like, your upbringing. You mentioned growing up in France, but, like, I feel like you have, like, 3 different nationalities or 4 or something. So talk to me a little bit about that, like, growing up, where you grew up, and, maybe, like, moving around and ultimately coming to the US.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So I was born in, Columbus, in Georgia. And then just a few weeks. And then and so my mom is, was born in DC, so she's American and Italian. She also grew up in Europe.
Rudy Von Berg:And, my dad is, French speaking Belgium. And then, yeah. So very quickly, I grew up in France till I was 19. But, you know, I kinda we always kept kinda my American roots in France. It's not like, you know, I'm I I my English was my first language and, you know, just in the family life.
Rudy Von Berg:We'd go to Paris for Thanksgiving, to my aunts, and things like that. And then when I was 19, yeah, just moved to Boulder, to study. And also it was on my own it was my only choice because linked to the endurance land that Boulder is. And, and then, yeah. I mean, then I've been there for, in Boulder for the last 11 years.
Rudy Von Berg:Plan on staying here. Yeah. And so I have an Italian passport as well. So I have an American and Italian passport. And, yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:I technically could be French or bel or Belgium too. But, yeah. I just don't have it. But
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Yeah. For sure. When so did were you coming over to the States frequently as a kid? Or when you came here as a 19 year old, was it, like, a bit of a culture shock?
Justin Metzler:Or were you pretty aware of, like, the American culture at the time?
Rudy Von Berg:I would say really a culture shock. We did a few trips just like New York or just holidays. My mom did the marathon and just things like that, or Hawaii for the race. So I I was around it a little, and just relatives and things like that. Sure.
Justin Metzler:So I
Rudy Von Berg:wouldn't say it was a culture shock. However, I mean, still growing up in France for, you know, 19 years, when I got to college here, there were some things a bit I mean, just stupid things like how everyone says, hey. How are you? And I was, like, awkward when to answer that every time.
Justin Metzler:Is that not commonplace in France?
Rudy Von Berg:Well, not really. Like, I don't know. Wait. Do people just not ask? Now.
Rudy Von Berg:I know in French, it is. But I don't know. It was just a bit it was just systematic, and I just remember not knowing what to say. You know?
Justin Metzler:It's funny because Jeanne and I talk because, you know, my wife, Jeanne, is South African. So she's like, people in America say hi. How are you? But it's more of a greeting rather than actually, like
Rudy Von Berg:It's just saying hi.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. It's not actually asking. How
Rudy Von Berg:are you?
Justin Metzler:Yeah. So but in South Africa, if you actually ask how you how are you, they expect a response.
Rudy Von Berg:So That that was my thinking. So I was like, oh, yeah. You know, I'm good. Yeah. Like or try to elaborate a bit, and they were like, yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:I don't care.
Justin Metzler:Totally. Yeah. No. It is funny. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:A 100%. So you mentioned your mother running the marathon and being in Kona. Like, your dad's somewhat of a famous triathlon guy now. He's pretty active on social media in the triathlon world and was, obviously, a triathlete in his day. Your mom was a marathon runner.
Justin Metzler:Was she a triathlete as well?
Rudy Von Berg:No. Never triathlon. Okay.
Justin Metzler:So Yeah. Anyways, like, very endurance sport family. Like, what was your first triathlon or endurance sport memory as a kid?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I'd I'd have to say this is the one I always talk about even though it's hard to really, you know, remember details. But when I was 5 years old, I was in Kona in in 1998 watching my dad race, and then we would go every 5 4 years or 4 to 5 years because no. It was 4 years because it was, 98, 2002, 2006. Every new age group pretty much for my dad.
Rudy Von Berg:Because coming from Europe and the prep for it was kind of a big prep and a big Sure. Or a big trip organization and all. So he didn't wanna do it every year. But, yeah. So every 4 years, so 98.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So when I was 5, 9, 13, And then, yeah. Sorry. I forgot your question now.
Justin Metzler:No. I was just asking, like what your earliest memory was of, yeah, triathlon.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. It was going to those races. Also Nice, you know, was a big race. Sure. Now we have the world champs there.
Rudy Von Berg:It was like ITU long distance world champs. I also remember some ITU long dis yeah. Some other worlds like Emenstadt in Germany and, Ironman Austria, Claggenfort. So yeah. A lot of just the the big Ironmans that my dad would go as with, as with the family.
Justin Metzler:Sure. And how triathlon was obviously a big part of your upbringing, just your dad being probably he was training a whole bunch and, you know, it was a big topic of conversation in your family. Like, how much of the idea of triathlon was he trying to instill in you, and how much did you just naturally gravitate towards it?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Obviously, he was big on Indian sports and triathlon, and that that's what we kinda grew up with, but he never really pushed me or pushed us, my brother and my sister as well, to have we have to do triathlon or anything like that. He was big on just he's just really passionate about sports in general, so he thinks the values of sport and all that, all that sport can teach you are very important in life, so he's really and for health. Sure. That that those are really important for him.
Rudy Von Berg:So any sport. So, you know, I did football, like, or soccer how you would say here, tennis, skiing, swim biking, and running, but kinda like individually. Yeah. So I was he even at one point, he even said, asked if I wanted to go do piano. I think I did one piano lesson.
Rudy Von Berg:We could tell that it wasn't for me, even though I love the piano. But yeah. So that's kinda what he did. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. That's cool. And when did you start taking up triathlon as a hobby that you really enjoyed? Or, I guess, like, not not a career at the time, but when did you start training properly?
Rudy Von Berg:I'd say when I was maybe 15 is when I kinda dropped the other sports. So 15 on was only swim, bike, run. I would still play football and kinda basketball at home or at school, But that's just, like, not in the US. It's not like basketball teams. It was just during the the playtime, you know, between classes.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So I'd say from then on is kinda when I focus more. And then also in 2011, I think it was, I went to Australia for 5 months to go to training group. So that's when I was, what, 18, 19. Or that was yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:So I moved here when I was 19. So when I was 17 to 18. So I'd say, yeah, you could say that's when I started really seriously. However, I mean, I've been always swimming, biking, and running since I was little, you know. I always hated swimming though.
Rudy Von Berg:I remember crying and not wanting to go to swim practice. So I was never really, like, yeah, I never really grew up swimming that much. You know, it was like max 3 times a week. Sure. And that's already when I was starting to get a bit more motivated.
Rudy Von Berg:But there were many, there were years where I would only swim once, twice a week. So
Justin Metzler:Yep. For sure. And when we first met, you know, you were trying to really chase that Olympic dream. That was kind of a big deal. I remember you doing some long course races in conjunction with the ITU races, but, you definitely were doing a lot of the ITU events on the circuit.
Justin Metzler:When did you decide that maybe that wasn't the path for you? And how long did you try to kind of, like, make that dream happen?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Well, so I mean, when you're a junior, you know, you you're not gonna really do or I guess you can't even do them when you're under 18. Right? So So I was naturally just doing the ITU circuit. That's if you're kinda in the perspective of being competitive or going pro eventually in triathlon.
Rudy Von Berg:So you're gonna do ITU. There's no nothing else really you can do. Yes. So I progressed a bit. Conti Cups, World Cups, there's a couple of World Series, but, my swim was too weak.
Rudy Von Berg:Also, I always had it in the back of my mind, yeah, Kona, you know, from my childhood what I explained earlier. Sure. That was always the dream. And, you know, ITU, you're just constantly traveling. You're going to these South American races where the travel is just horrible or China or wherever.
Rudy Von Berg:And it's just, you know, it's just not as nice of a lifestyle. And also you're under Federation, so there's the added politics. Originally when I was in south of France, I was close to Italy, so it was easier to race with Italian Federation. And yeah, there were also politics there. I couldn't get into some races.
Rudy Von Berg:And so all that combined and then, yeah, just me being not that good of a swimmer. I mean, I worked on it throughout the years, but in ITU at the time, I was never in the front pack. So I was just and, you know, sometimes I would have really good bike and runs, but I could see these athletes that I thought I was way superior to beat me just because they were 2 minutes ahead at the end of the bike, you know, and you're running 5 k, so you're not gonna catch them. So, yeah, the whole thing was just a bit frustrating. And after a while, yeah, I just knew I was gonna start doing halves.
Rudy Von Berg:And as I as you said, I did a season or maybe a couple where I did a couple of halves and still did some ITU. And also I had in the back of my head, you don't you wanna keep your speed, you know, you wanna develop through the distances. You don't wanna do a full Ironman when you're 22. So that's kinda maybe that's a bit more the old school mentality, but that's kinda what I, did. And so that's why I only did my first full Ironman when I was, what, 27?
Rudy Von Berg:So, yeah, that was the idea behind the whole thing. I mean, the Olympics would have been awesome, obviously. But for me, the dream was always more Kona.
Justin Metzler:Sure. Yeah. I wanna get to that because, yeah, you I think last weekend or 2 weekends ago was the Ironman World Championships where you came on the podium. So I wanna circle back to that, but I definitely wanna dive a little bit more into some training specific questions. Like, I've observed your training from a little bit of afar.
Justin Metzler:Obviously, I'm a big Strava fan, so I followed what you've done on Strava. And, you know, in town, we all, you know, to a certain degree, talk about each other's training. You're currently still coached by McCall, Eden? Yep. That's okay.
Justin Metzler:Cool. I wanna circle back to that as well, but I feel like your progression in your career and your races have just sort of, like, steadily gotten better year after year after year, and so that's been really impressive. Walk me through some of the coaches that you've had along the way and maybe one impactful thing that you've learned from each of them.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So for the Boulder period, yeah, I was self coached at the beginning, when I was in college because, I mean, obviously, that's just quite that's just easier. And, then after one point so Simon Lessing had the the master's group and he had a coaching, business. And so in for a couple years there, I was coached by Simon Lessing, as all of you know, triathlon legend, living in Boulder, as Dave Scott is here as well and and we know a few others. And, he was, I think it's how he trained his his coaching method, which makes sense.
Rudy Von Berg:But it was a lot of just it was just all all hard, kinda. And also I was at that age where I didn't really know better so I was just kinda doing everything hard. And I don't think that brought the best out of me in racing. You're just a bit tired and you just don't build how you should, you know, your training. And, so like a January training week would be the same as a July training week, more or less.
Rudy Von Berg:Sure. So, yeah, that wasn't perfect for me. But I mean, you know, I was in that mindset. I worked hard. I put in put in the hours, and I was enjoying it.
Rudy Von Berg:And, you know, and and he's Simon is a very good guy, so I enjoyed having him as a coach as well. And Darren Durek as well for the the run part. There was a run group. So I think it was good at the time. And then after that in 2018, I started working with Luc Van Lierde, the Belgian, Kona winner twice in the nineties.
Rudy Von Berg:And, that was a bit pivotal in my career, in terms of how he coached and then the results I got from that. He was that was kind of a 180 on the training. A lot of, zone 2, you could call it, training, just endurance, you know, easy training. And very yeah. Just overall very little intensity.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, some people were just shocked at the amount of intensity I was doing. You know, you it was it's I would call it kinda like sprinkling your endurance with intensity. So just a little bit here and there. Obviously, a little more closer to the race or at critical moments, maybe 3, 4 weeks out. And, and at that point, I was specializing in on 70.3 distance.
Rudy Von Berg:And, and also we would focus that's the big part of this coaching. We'd focus on VLA. And for those who don't know that, that's kind of the way you use your energy. So a sprinter, his VLA will be very high because, you know, all your energy you're using it for 10 seconds and then you're just done, you know? Triathlete, Ironman, let's say is the opposite.
Rudy Von Berg:You want a very low VLA, like low lactate numbers. You're super efficient, but you're way more diesel. And so focusing on the VLA for half Ironman, I would kinda be in the middle. So I would have a lot of energy still in halves to really push, like, to numbers that I didn't think I could do. Like, no way I could I would think I could do the numbers I did in races from my training, but I would just always be in that state that I was just so ready to go in halves.
Rudy Von Berg:And, yeah, I would train very little or race week, for example. So that was really interesting. I had a lot of success in 70.3 with that method. But then I my last race with Luke was my first Ironman, Ironman France in 2022. And, then I mean, I won the race, but, you know, it wasn't a super high level race.
Rudy Von Berg:And, I didn't think I did as well as I should have. Maybe there were a couple of nutrition problems. You know, I lost I didn't have water for the first after 30 minutes for, like, 45 minutes. I had no water, at the beginning of the bike. Things like that could have affected me.
Rudy Von Berg:And, you know, I'm sure nutrition wasn't fully dialed even though it was already on never second, and it still worked quite well. But, so after that, just my overall idea and why I switched to McCall Eton was since Ironman World Championship was gonna be my focal point for the few next few years or for the rest of my career, essentially. I didn't think Luke was the best for me to get to my potential in full Ironman, maybe because of that low intensity or not much intensity. You know, I just had the idea that, like, how am I gonna really improve my run if I'm, like, just running easy all the time. Sure.
Rudy Von Berg:And, yeah. So now the last few years I've been with McCall. And, yeah. That's born of a Norwegian method, kinda focusing on a lot of, threshold work and, yeah, like, aerobic threshold or, anaerobic threshold.
Justin Metzler:Sure. Do you feel like because you've been a pro for, you know, 10 plus years like myself. Do you feel like the game is different now and requires different training? Like, Luke's training might have been really good and really competitive in 2015, for example, but now in 2024, it requires a totally different set of training.
Rudy Von Berg:No. Probably not. I mean, I think it's still to be determined, you know? I did just one full under him but, I think for halves, I mean, I was super strong. Sure.
Rudy Von Berg:And I think it's all about, you know, doing the best that your body can do, right? That's all you can control. And I think with Luke, I mean, that was it. You know, I mean, I ran a 109 half, marathon off a off a bike, obviously, in, like, in a in a half Ironman. I did some Watts on the bike that in training I could only do for, like, 5 minutes at a time, and I did it for over 2 hours.
Rudy Von Berg:You know, things like that. I was like, wow, like, I am just so able to transcend myself in a race day.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. That's cool. And, you
Rudy Von Berg:know, it's all about that. We all have our good days in training and we all think, oh, if I could have this day in the race, it'd be awesome. And that would be every race for me. So I'd be like, I'm at a 100% of what I can do on race today.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. And you're probably looking at everyone else in town who's absolutely smashing themselves up left hand every day and being like, hey, guys. No one's paying you to go on TC up to Jamestown or whatever. I feel like just observing your training and being around you for a while, you're a bit of a lone wolf when it comes to your training, and you really seem to trust your plan. Are you paying attention to what others are doing?
Justin Metzler:Do you get worked up about what you see maybe Christian doing on Strava or if Sam Long's doing something on Strava or whatever? Like, are you paying attention to any of that? Or once you have your training plan, you're just super locked in?
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, it's it's a bit of both. I mean, I'm I am super locked in, and and that's why I don't join too many people too often in training because over the very, the simple answer is I just think people go too hard and every time every easy runs or easy rides are just a bit too hard. And then I just don't think it's productive for my training. So that's why I just rather kinda do my my bill on my own for that. I do follow some pros on Shava, but I really try to limit it for for that reason because, yeah, you can get quite a bit quite insecure from that.
Rudy Von Berg:Because I don't train that fast. It's not for lack of trying or anything, but I just can't do the watts or to even to run paces or even or in all three sports, honestly. I cannot do the paces that a lot of the guys are doing. And those are, and plenty of those guys are guys I'd be at every single race. And I just, I never really understood that.
Rudy Von Berg:So it's important for my confidence to not look too much at what the others do. I mean, by now I just know it's a fact that people are kind of training faster than me. So but still it it can always still get to you a bit, you know? Like, I'm like, wow, I thought I was in before Kona this year, I thought I was in great shape. And then I just always see you guys that are just, like, one upping me and I'm like, damn, like
Justin Metzler:In training, you're saying?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Yeah. In training.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Of course. That's interesting. Do you have those conversations with Michal? Because he has direct access to Christian Blumenfeld and his brother Gustaf.
Justin Metzler:So he knows their numbers. He knows the insights as to what they're doing.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Not that not that much anymore. But yeah.
Justin Metzler:Okay. So maybe now he's a little bit removed. But maybe 2 years ago, he had a pretty good understanding as to what those guys were doing, or do you not think so?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I think he probably has a a pretty good understanding of what they're doing.
Justin Metzler:So you're not having conversations around, like, okay. What are those guys doing and what do I need to do in training to do the same thing?
Rudy Von Berg:No. I think, yeah, that's, like, the wrong mentality to have. Sure. It kinda like how Lionel was trying to emulate what all the others were doing and now he's all about I mean, he always changes anyways, but Yeah. And now he's all about, you know, I gotta do what's good for myself and, you know, and that's it.
Rudy Von Berg:And, I mean, I think overall that's good, and that's what I
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Rudy Von Berg:doing a hard training session or
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Justin Metzler:One other thing I'm curious is to to hear about is what do you do outside of training to ensure that you're as consistent as you have been? Like, is there anything that you're doing from a recovery perspective that, is just keeping you ticking away at this super consistent level?
Rudy Von Berg:No. I mean, the main thing is just try to nail the the basics, essentially. Like, nail the 90, 95%. And, that's overall, it's simplifying your life. So, you know, it's just training, recovering, sleeping.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, it doesn't mean I don't see friends. Well, I've had roommates in my house. So honestly, that helps quite a bit because if I'm training alone, at least I'm not alone at home. So there's always some kind of social aspect and, people around and I'm people think I'm, like, super serious and all, but actually at home or with the people I'm close with, I'm, like, always messing around and talking shit and all sorts of things. So that really, I think, helps to have that at home.
Rudy Von Berg:And, yeah, a lot of people do do a lot of things. I think they're, you know, all that just we hear everywhere, marginal gains, whatever. But I don't think these things help. If you nail the 90, 95%, I mean, you're 98% there, you know? And it's also really hard to nail.
Rudy Von Berg:It's simple and really hard at the same time, right? Yeah. Absolutely. Like, you always have you can have sickness injury, overdo some training, you know, just all those simple things that can mess up your build. And so, yeah, again, just nailing that that part is the most important.
Justin Metzler:Sure. It seems also that, like, when you were training with Luke, there was definitely an element of intensity control. We know the Norwegians are famous for their intensity control. You were one of the first people in town to start using a lactate monitor frequently on your training, you know, posting about, you know, taking lactate, and this must have been
Rudy Von Berg:2019. 18 already. Yes. Since since Luke.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. And that really hadn't been popularized by many people outside of the lab. Like, 2018, I was doing lactate ramp tests in a lab, but it wasn't like I was taking the lactate monitor out for a run, or going to the track and doing that, but you were carrying it with you on bike rides and stuff. When did you when did that grab your attention, and why were you committed to that? Are you still committed to that?
Justin Metzler:And, yeah, what's your general perspective on it?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Actually, under Luke's, so we would do testing. That was all at home. We'd do it about 3 times a year. And, you know, in those tests, and they would there would be also longer tests.
Rudy Von Berg:They would they would be a bit more complicated than the basic VO 2 max test because we would have to calculate the VLA, which as I said, is was an really important metric for him. And, so, you know, I would use, like, 40, 50 strips over 2 days. But then, actually, at the time in training, I wasn't really using the the strips. I would just kinda base myself on the test, you know, for to do the the training. And then it's it's actually a bit more when everyone started talking about the Norwegians and all.
Rudy Von Berg:And when I started coach, starting with McCall a little bit at the end of Luke, did on some sessions. But, yeah, it's just a bit more kinda when everyone started doing it that I started doing it more as well. But, yeah, you know, it's like, I was looking at Leon Chevalier, for example. He did a q and a just this morning. And, and the question was like, do you use lactate strips or whatever?
Rudy Von Berg:And he was like, no, never. You know, just I know exactly how I feel and or just, you know, riding hard and how I feel my body and sensation is the most important. And in the end, you know, it is, we can't forget all that. And he's all, and he was, it was a bit of a joke, but he was like, every time you're testing your lactate, I'm still out riding and putting in more hours and minutes than you, you know? Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:And it's a bit true, you know? For sure. You can't be like too vocalized on that. Like it's a good training tool to check your intensity and see kind of where you're at. But oftentimes when I think more when you're fit, when you're very unfit, you know, it can be a bit all over the place.
Rudy Von Berg:But when you're fit, you know, we know where our lactate is, you know, before getting the reading.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Absolutely. How much is Michal prescribing lactates these days versus just saying, hey. Here's the power I want you to hit for these intervals or paces or heart rate or whatever?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. We kinda he doesn't really he did it more at the beginning when we worked together, like, or me asking for what lactate I should hit. And we do, still talk about it, but, he he doesn't put it really anymore. Like, I know kinda what I'm trying to hit. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:And so, yeah, he puts he says pace is where each other hit. But also for me, you know, I'm very kinda I'm very not intrinsically, but, like, I'm very good at just executing the plan and not really needing my coach too much. Sure. Like, I feel like I know what I need to do in sessions. You know, I always kind of build the session, go by feel, see how you feel, and all that.
Rudy Von Berg:And so I don't really need a coach telling me, okay. You have to run up this pace. Like, I just know how I'm gonna do the session that will give you the best results. You know?
Justin Metzler:Sure. Is your guys' relationship pretty collaborative, or is it he writes the plan and you execute the plan, or he writes the plan and you execute your perception of what you feel like you need? What does it look like?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Overall, it's pretty, he writes the plan and I execute it. And as long as I can I do it well, and I think it I mean, it makes sense and, energy levels are good and then I pretty much yeah? There's not much collaboration, I'd say. And, I mean, we talk, you know, we don't talk much.
Rudy Von Berg:But Yeah. If we still talk enough that it's, you know, we can see what or I can see what's kind of the plans going forward and all that. But again, you know, yeah, I'm good at just doing the plan and making it happen and not moving things around or thing. If the plan makes sense, you know, you can just plug in the weeks, week on week in, week out and make it happen. And one of my biggest philosophies is building throughout the weeks.
Rudy Von Berg:So when you're in a training plan, let's say I had 11 weeks for Kona, in my head I'm like, okay, the first 3 weeks, for example, or even 4 weeks, I don't care about pace at all. Like, if I'm doing run threshold at 6 minute pace at the beginning, and that's that would be, like, anaerobic threshold, well, I I don't care. You know?
Justin Metzler:Yeah. You just get it done.
Rudy Von Berg:Because in the end, if you're you know, a threshold is it's an upper limit. So if you're under it, you're still in that window of the threshold. But if you're a bit over and a bit too fast, actually, it's almost like the session is not doing anything for your threshold because you were above it. You know?
Justin Metzler:Yeah. You're tapping into a completely different energy system. Yeah. So that makes that makes a 100% sense. You mentioned getting trained by Simon, probably super high volume, super high intensity.
Justin Metzler:Getting coached by Luke, relatively lower volume, lower intensity. Now you're in kind of a maybe that's not accurate.
Rudy Von Berg:Simon was, moderate volume, a lot of intensity. Luke, we got to fairly high volume and low intensity. Well, you have to. Right? Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:If you're in low intensity and low volume, well, then You're
Justin Metzler:gonna be unfit.
Rudy Von Berg:Right. Yeah. And then, McCall is, I wouldn't say it's high volume, but that's also just me, you know. I can't Sure. I can't tolerate high volume if I'm doing intensity regularly.
Rudy Von Berg:Yep. So, you know, I'm I'm averaging 25, 26 hours maybe. Sure.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. That was my question is what are the hours looking like? And was that over the 11 week build in Tacoma, were you in that 25 to 26 hour territory?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I did I started, you know, 23, then it was, like, 25, 26, 28. But then again, the last few weeks with some of the bigger key sessions and stuff, I couldn't keep the volume. It just Sure. So I had a few weeks, even like I'm week minus 3, minus 4, where you'd expect still having maybe 30 hour weeks or whatever.
Rudy Von Berg:The couple weeks there are 23 hours. And, you know, you just have to look what makes sense in your week, not being fixated. Oh, I have to do 30 hours. You know? Sure.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah.
Justin Metzler:So it seems like it's a bit fluid. Is there, like, a traditional periodization in there of, like, a 3 on one off? Or are you just saying, okay. We've got 11 weeks. Maybe mentally, you're breaking up as it into chunks of I care about pace here.
Justin Metzler:I don't care about pace there. Is are you guys working on a periodization or some sort of cycle, or is it just kinda like clean, consistent weeks? And as you get closer to the race, you're just nailing big
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So we've we've he's changed the structure over the years, and I think it's gonna keep on changing. For this block, it was the week were weeks were the same, actually, which is not usually how we've done it. But it was Monday was an easy active recovery day. Tuesday was, you could call it double threshold even though so there is a caveat to, me following his plan.
Rudy Von Berg:It's just on the swim, I don't follow it essentially. Okay. Yeah. So I follow perfectly bike run. And then swim, I follow kinda overall, but then overall I do quite a bit less intensity actually than what he gives.
Rudy Von Berg:Sure. And I've tried it in the past and for the the swim, I just feel like it just doesn't work. Yeah. To do the long threshold. I just feel like I just get slower and slower and slower.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So double threshold. So so I'd have the run threshold on Tuesday, but the swim, sometimes I would swim a bit hard, sometimes not. And that's valid for all all the other days where I'll say there's a double threshold. So, yeah, Monday is the active recovery.
Rudy Von Berg:Tuesday, the intensity on the run. And that's still with all 3 sports, but I'm just saying the intensity part. Wednesday, volume day, easy aerobic. Thursday was bike intervals and also kinda double threshold idea. Friday would be an active recovery day.
Rudy Von Berg:So Monday, Friday would be active recovery. And then the weekend, it would change a little, but Saturday would be kind of a ride I'm trying to remember. Like, one day, there's a break. Saturday would be a bike, yeah, bike run break. And then Sunday would be a long, ride with, like, l t one
Justin Metzler:f Ironman efforts. Sure. And are you you mentioned swim bike run. Are you doing swim bike run every day even on the active recovery days?
Rudy Von Berg:On no. I would do only 2 sports on active recovery days. And then some days, closer to the race, actually, when I'd be a bit tired or whatever, some days, I would just do a 2 k swim, and that's it.
Justin Metzler:Sure. And what about the double threshold days? So Tuesday, if you did a threshold run sub threshold run-in the morning and then threshold swim, would you go for, like, a ride that day as well?
Rudy Von Berg:There'd usually be all 3 on on those days.
Justin Metzler:Okay. So it'd be, like, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, all 3, Saturday, Sunday, all 3 more or less?
Rudy Von Berg:Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. Yeah. More or less. Or Sunday, Sundays, some of the Sundays, I would only have the ride if it was just quite long. But, yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:But, actually, no. I would have a 5 k swim on Sundays too, but maybe not on the Saturday.
Justin Metzler:Got it.
Rudy Von Berg:So Yeah.
Justin Metzler:So 5 swims a
Rudy Von Berg:week. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:What, walk me through, like, your biggest or hardest or most memorable day in that 11 week Kona block.
Rudy Von Berg:There's one day I just I remember just because the run was really good. We did a 2 and a half hour ride with some intervals. I think it was 3 by 30 minutes. I kinda like built and the power fell easy. It was like 260, 270, 285, or something for 3 by 30.
Rudy Von Berg:And then went into a 2 hour run with Brian and Tyler Butterfield. Yep. Guys that I do some runs with, and it really helps for, long runs like that or threshold runs on the track. For for some of you guys that don't know, Tyler Butterfield was a professional, and he lives in Boulder, and he joins a lot of the guys on some sessions. And he talks a lot too, which is nice.
Justin Metzler:Tyler was probably top 5 in Kona three times or something. Top 10
Rudy Von Berg:at least. Top 10 and he was 5th 1 year, I think. Yeah. And still running, like, 220 to 225 marathon. So he's
Justin Metzler:He ran, Commonwealth Games marathon and, yeah, 219 at Tokyo, I believe.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I don't think he broke the 220. He was at he did 220.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Yeah. Flat. Yeah. Anyways, very, very good triathlete and runner.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. And so we did, and then so we did a 2 hour run of which for me is big. Like, I very rarely do 2 hour runs. Sure. And, and we ran 6 minute pace, average.
Rudy Von Berg:So the whole 2 hours. And it was, like, easy, flowy, you know? So that was, one session I remember. And then then the always the one that's 2 weeks out is usually one of my biggest ones, we kinda built. So that one with the bricks I mentioned that I do on Saturdays and the long ride on Sundays.
Rudy Von Berg:And so I would do, about 180 k or a bit less. But the idea is to do kinda 4 hours, you know, at LT 1 or race pace. So that was in Kona. I arrived in Kona about 4 days earlier. And so on the Sunday, a little, 2 weeks minus one day out from the race, I went to Javy and back.
Rudy Von Berg:So it was a 100 and well, actually, I miss Javy. So I rode like 2
Justin Metzler:miles further. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:Because it's such a low key town and I didn't even realize I was TT ing. And but then after a while I was like, I don't remember Javi being this far. Sure. Yeah. So I did an extra, you know, 4, 5 miles.
Rudy Von Berg:But, yeah, it was 175 k with 4 hours at 275 watts. And then into, on that day, I did 1 hour 37 run. So just shy of 25 kilometers, kinda all at, like, ltone slash race pace. I was actually a bit dead at the beginning. So I thought that run would would go much that I would do it much faster or at least a bit faster, than what I did.
Rudy Von Berg:It was 358 per k. So, like, a 2 forties well, actually close to what I did in the race. It's like a 2 46, 2 47 pace. Yeah. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, so that's a pretty big day, you know. Sure. I see other guys doing other crazy stuff even closest to race and even bigger, but that's not me. I mean, that's already a pretty big day. And, you know, the whole idea is to build to be at your best on race day.
Rudy Von Berg:Like, I'm not trying to do my best at that session. Sure. You know? And yeah.
Justin Metzler:And what are you doing in that session? Because I feel like most athletes get to the island pro and age group. They get so excited. They get caught up in the midst of it all. They sit there and say, oh, on race day, I wanna do 300 watts, and I wanna run 3 45 per k.
Justin Metzler:And regardless of the RPE and the heart rate and the power, we all saw in Lionel's prerace videos, he was just totally bypassing all of those metrics and just doing the pace that he wanted to hit on the day. Like, what are you using to control yourself and actually save it for race day rather than leaving it in that session?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I mean, it's just ingrained in me. I'm I'm building for a race. So in no session I mean, sure. I'm going hard, like, in some threshold sessions.
Rudy Von Berg:But, you know, I don't know. I just always have the idea in the back of my mind that I'm building for the race. I'm not trying to do my best sessions in any, session or my yeah. And, yeah, I mean, I look at heart rate, watts. I have my core sensor for my core temperature.
Rudy Von Berg:So I look at all those values and, I'm aware it's hot and humid. I probably didn't hydrate enough the 1st few days. I was actually worried before that break that it was gonna be a bust, a bit like before Roth actually. Because I did that one in Boulder. It was it was one in June, you know, when it was really hot.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. For sure. I melted on the bike. I did 160 k. I was trying to hold 40 k's an hour for that ride.
Rudy Von Berg:Binh Yien, that was just like 38 or 39, but that was just I melted. I was just so done. And I was supposed to do a 1 hour 40 run or something, and I ran 5 k. And then But already, yeah, in the 1st k, I knew I was dead. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:Been there. Been there. Bolded at me. We have the altitude here too. So if you have a 100 degree day,
Rudy Von Berg:it's hard to do. Yeah. And, yeah. So I thought maybe it was gonna I didn't want it to happen like that because I had such a good build for Kona. But, you know, I've drank a ton of electrolytes, on the the Friday and the Saturday before the break.
Rudy Von Berg:And, yeah. It went overall quite well even though, as I said, the the run wasn't really what I wanted. But, you know, Kona is just we always say that it's, like, kinda hits different. I mean, it's hilly. It's hot.
Rudy Von Berg:It's humid. And all that's just gonna take pace out of you. You know?
Justin Metzler:Yeah. For sure. Yeah. So if you have that context, it's important. You can't compare what you were doing in your training back home to what you expect to do on the island, and it seems like it worked pretty well in the race.
Justin Metzler:I wanna shift over to talking a little bit about mindset, some mindset questions. The first one that I've got here is, from my perspective, sitting at home, watching a lot of the the interviews and stuff, you were talking about a great race being a top five finish, which is an amazing day on the island in what was a super competitive start list. There was tons of guys who could have been in that top ten. How did you predict so accurately that your form was in that place, and what was pointing to the fact that a top 5 or in the actuality of the case, a podium was in the cards?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I was just kinda more comparing to myself. Like, again, if if I look at all the new aero setups the guy guys have and the fitness they're they have or that they show, you know, it's always easy to be insecure and think, oh, well, yeah, actually or or look at your objectives, kinda look them think they should be a bit lower. But, I knew compared to myself, I was hitting really good sessions. As I told you, that 2 hour run off the bike, for example, or, some bike sessions, you know, I get you get to a point in some builds where just the power feels so good and easy, you know?
Rudy Von Berg:Like usually 280 watts for 30 minutes plus for me is quite hard. And when you get to a point where that's just no problem at all Yeah. Well then I know on race day, I'll be able to push 290 or 300 for 4 hours plus. And so I know when I'm at that kind of shape that even though people crush training and looks like they can do 3 20 for the Ironman, I know they never end up performing like that on race day. So I just know I'll be kinda in that competitive, top 5.
Rudy Von Berg:But I mean, I'm also well aware that a lot of guys can have good races and, you know, I'm really gonna have to be on my game. It's not like, oh, for sure I'm top 5. Like, I'm really concentrated on my process and I'm getting in my best shape possible. Like, yeah, I noticed the whole thing's gonna be quite hard. For the podium, specifically, I actually thought it's I think it's always like that.
Rudy Von Berg:When you achieve something, you're like, actually it wasn't that bad, you know? And when you're chasing it for years, you're like, oh my God, I'm gonna have to have this insane performance to be on the podium in Kona. But then when you do it, you're kinda like, like it wasn't. And that's actually what I think of my performance. I think it was very good on the day.
Rudy Von Berg:Obviously, a lot of guys faded a lot on the run. But, you know, it wasn't I didn't I don't feel like I transcended myself. Maybe like I mentioned in some past half Ironmans. Sure. I I did I mean, 290 watts is very good, especially in the heat, and especially being able to run after.
Rudy Von Berg:But again, I thought actually I would have gonna have to push 300. So a bit shy as what I thought would be for a podium. And then on the run, well, even a bit more. The run is a bit long, so official time, 248. On my training peaks marathon time, I had 24650.
Justin Metzler:Okay. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:So, yeah, a bit quicker. Because for example, you know, you look at Roth marathon times, technically, on the official time, I'm 5 minutes slower in Kona. Yep. But actually, I'm one second a k slower. Right.
Rudy Von Berg:So just 40 seconds slower is almost exactly the same. Sure. And one was 243 and one was 248. So I think that's important to look at too. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:So as I was explaining, just I don't feel like I think I did I executed really well and had obviously a really good race, but I didn't transcend myself and do what I thought I would have to do to be on the podium. You know? Sure.
Justin Metzler:In a race like that, where you've got such big hitters, Laid Lowe, Christian, Magnus, are you looping yourself into, like, your own pre race thoughts of how the race dynamic's gonna go? Or are those guys in your mind, are you intimidated by them at all, I guess, is the question?
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, a little. I mean, they're they were the favorites. Yeah. Christian Dyatlov and Leylo. Top three favorites.
Rudy Von Berg:Definitely thought if they're on their game, you know, it's gonna be very hard to get on the podium if all 3, perform to what they can do. But, you know, it's Kona and people a lot of things can go wrong. And I mean, that's the sport. Right? You can't say, oh, you got 3rd or 5th or whatever because this guy bonked.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, a big thing of Ironman is not bonking. Right?
Justin Metzler:Of course. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:So obviously, you can't say any of that. And, executing on on the race day is is the hardest thing. For sure. So, yeah. I mean, they're in the back of your mind.
Rudy Von Berg:Obviously, they're they're the best right now. But, yeah. Again, just you have to focus on your performance and because what the best out of yourself is the only thing that can potentially beat them. Sure. Not worrying about them and trying to follow them or whatever.
Rudy Von Berg:So
Justin Metzler:Yep. It seems as though, you know, you had a podium at 70.3 worlds in 2019. And were you 4th in Nice? Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:Last year.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. So you've had this ability to be able to kinda turn up on big championship race days. Is there something you're doing different in the preparation or the final approach to a world championship event that you're not doing at other races, or are you just treating everything the same and trying to be peaking?
Rudy Von Berg:No. Well, overall, I just usually tend to peak more at the end of the season, and championship season is always September, October. So that is one part. Yeah. Honestly, that's maybe the biggest part of my answer.
Rudy Von Berg:I don't really do things much different if I'm training for a really important race in June, let's say, rather than in September or October. Throughout the years, for example, 2018, I win South American 70.3 South American championship, in in Buenos Aires in was it October or November? Yep. 19, I have the the really good race in Nice in September. And Buenos Aires actually in, end of October, where I ran a 110 and just had a, yeah, super good race there.
Rudy Von Berg:Be a runner, Pablo da Pena. When, you know, when he
Justin Metzler:was running Yeah. Pablo was flying that year.
Rudy Von Berg:Super fast. Yeah. I never thought I could beat him on a run. Sure. And we remain we were in T2 together.
Rudy Von Berg:Nice. Yeah. And then 2020 Daytona, 5th in the PTO championship. Yeah. So I guess I always kind of managed to really finish strong rather than other athletes.
Rudy Von Berg:I think maybe overtrain in the 1st part of the season, peak too early, and can't really hold it throughout the season. Sure. And And I always manage to build towards the end of season. So I guess that's, yeah, just the main part of my And maybe, yeah, mentality wise, I mean, obviously the mental part is super important. So if you're the type, you can easily be a bit scared of championship races because there's so many big names and it's just hard to get the best out of yourself in those situations.
Rudy Von Berg:So I'm sure, the mental work of them, because this is not just in me, you know, of, I was like a insecure, shy, you know, 15 year old that are scared of all the guys that looked way fitter than me. And, you know, so it's not like I've just always had it, but, yeah, just maybe the that mental part of not not getting into that mindset on the big races can play a big role.
Justin Metzler:Sure. Have you worked with, like, a mental coach, or is that just something you've done on your own?
Rudy Von Berg:On my own. I've always had this idea since I moved from home, when I was 19 that I'm really the strongest in my own head. The outside people kinda always can make me think of things I haven't thought about in a negative way or just all that. And so, yeah, I just always have this idea. I'm the best when I'm concentrated on myself and, you know, being my own, own person I talk to in a way.
Rudy Von Berg:Sure. Yeah. So
Justin Metzler:Is there ever, like, a part of you that wants to explore a self coaching option down the road so you have that complete control in your mind, or is training different from maybe your mental approach and your mental training?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I've thought about that obviously the last few years, but, I don't wanna spend the time thinking about my training that much. Yeah. I feel feel like I would just always be thinking about it and that's draining. And I honestly, even though I feel like I'm starting to know a lot throughout the coaches and the different methods about training, I still wouldn't really trust myself that I'm doing the right build.
Rudy Von Berg:Yep. And so I just think it's it's better to delegate for that.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Absolutely. And I feel like you if you have a coach and it goes poorly, you kinda have someone else to not blame, but maybe work through it with. Whereas if you have a bad race and you're self coached, this is coming from personal experience. It Yeah.
Justin Metzler:There's a lot of pressure that ends up, compounding and building in that environment.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. And I think it's important for that that your coach sticks to his philosophy. Sure. Rather than, oh, my athlete wants this, so I'll give him this. That's I think that's just bad because then both are failing in a way.
Rudy Von Berg:Exactly. Not following the philosophy, and you might not get the results because you're not following the philosophy for the coach and the athlete.
Justin Metzler:So 100%. 100%. Yeah. For sure. Cool.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Is there anything else, like, from a mindset perspective that you feel like you're maybe doing differently?
Rudy Von Berg:No. Make sure you mentioned it. Just not, yeah, not training with people too much, the the builds through for the races in terms of paces and all that.
Justin Metzler:What are you doing outside of training to balance it out? Like, you mentioned your roommates coming back and just having a joke with them. Is there anything else that you're doing to just try to maybe remove yourself from 30 hours a week of training?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. I mean, it's definitely, at times, it feels a bit crazy, right, training? When we're just every single day, a long training day, and you're like, I'm just gonna have to do this over and over and over again. It's a bit mind boggling. But, I don't feel like I need that much outside of triathlon.
Rudy Von Berg:So I'm not like one of the some of those guys that are just like, I'm going crazy. Like, I need to have these social things. I can't talk about triathlon. You know, you hear that a lot. I feel like I'm not, you know, obsessed on triathlon and talking 247 about it.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, now I have an awesome girlfriend, so that definitely helps. And, you know, we're excited about plenty of things in the future, trips, you know, so that brings you a bit out of triathlon and For sure. And, you know, maybe kids and dogs and all that stuff, you know. Yeah. You know, so, yeah, for me, that that's enough.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. And and family, you know, supportive family and all that.
Justin Metzler:Yep. How proud has your family been of you how much you've accomplished so far and especially just coming off, you know, a podium in Kona? That's gotta be a big thing for your family. Like, was that cool for them?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they were there, obviously, at the finish line. So they're the first people I saw, my dad, mom, girlfriend, sister. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, my my dad obviously is, he he's been passionate about the sport for so many years, and obviously following as closely as can be, my career. And, so he is obviously extremely happy and proud. And, yeah, he's always believed in me, obviously. But it's, it's another thing to, you know, to be there and witness it and and I did it for for the podium. The ultimate goal, as I said, you know, is to win the race.
Justin Metzler:Of course. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:But, a podium is already a huge step. So yeah. I mean, then we had a few days in a hotel to kinda just soak in and relax, after, the race. And, yeah. So that was really nice as well.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Awesome. I wanna rewind a little bit. Like, probably about 11 months ago, 2024 or 2023, excuse me, was a dominating year for you. You dominated Ironman Texas in the beginning of the season, and then Ironman Florida was arguably one of your better Ironmans to finish the season.
Justin Metzler:From there, you and Trec, your longtime sponsor, parted ways. Was that a shock to you at the time?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Definitely. They told me that was after my 4th place in Nice. So I had, yeah, I had the win in Texas with the was it the American no. That wasn't your American record.
Rudy Von Berg:Even though, you know, these we're talking about records. Mine I'm proud of mine because they're legit. I know my courses the courses I did them on Sure. Are full, you know. I have the 180 k on my Garmin, like Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:And you know the Garmin, you never start it right. So if if you have a 180 on your Garmin, you know it's legit.
Justin Metzler:For sure.
Rudy Von Berg:And the run and, you know, if you have a 50 minute swim from pack, you know also that's probably pretty legit. So I don't know where I'm going with this. What what was
Justin Metzler:I saying? I I just asked if it was a surprise to you that after the success that you had
Rudy Von Berg:Oh, yeah.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. With 4th place in Nice and 2 big Ironman victories.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Yeah. And I would I mean, so yeah. Definitely. And I was the top trick athlete in Ironman World, which arguably if your athlete if your your, best athlete at the most important race of the year, like, you don't drop that athlete.
Rudy Von Berg:Right? Yeah. So, yeah, it was definitely pretty, shocking news. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:Did that, like, spin you and your agent and your team into, like, a a backpedal mode? Because it is something that no one expected. You probably didn't expect that. Are you trying to, you know, salvage the ship at that point, or are you just trying to take a breath and be like, alright. We gotta recalibrate?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. No. Take a breath. I mean, I was, still under contract to the end of the year. So Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:Then I did really good at Florida, and that was the American record. Yep. And, so even more reason you're like, I mean, thinking just why the hell would Trek do that? And then they would keep athletes that I beat the whole year. And, yeah, I mean, honestly, I still don't know why.
Rudy Von Berg:I don't know if it's some kind of stupid reaction to what happened with the Laidlaw thing. Even though it blew over in like 4 days or less. Because, you know, Trek, they the next year they told their athletes, like, we don't they had like a Zoom, like a call with their athletes, you know, we don't want any controversy. We want you to be nice athletes. We don't want you to express any opinion essentially on, social media.
Rudy Von Berg:So, you know, when when another athlete tells me that, I'm like, oh, well that sounds like they didn't like the Laidlaw thing. Even though I wasn't part of it at all, it was, Laidlaw did something that he could be brought to court sued for. Like, he published a private email publicly. Mhmm. And you're not allowed to do that.
Rudy Von Berg:And it was only private emails. Nothing was public. Nothing was said about Laidlaw publicly. Sure. So it would be extremely dumb if that was the reason.
Rudy Von Berg:I do not know what was the reason. They just said, budget cuts.
Justin Metzler:Yep. Do you think that could have potentially been it? Right? Like, you're coming off the season where you are the best track triathlete at the time. Maybe Taylor Knibb is also, you know, super high of value.
Justin Metzler:And maybe Sam Long, you could argue, just from his social media presence and very good race results, he's a top
Rudy Von Berg:track athlete. And I I do wanna say I'm I'm never talk badly about any of my Trek peers at the time. Like, I refuse to do that. I respect the athletes. You know, it was Ben Kanute, Sam Long Absolutely.
Rudy Von Berg:Matthew Marcart, you know, all great athletes. And
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Deserving of Trek contracts, do you think from their perspective, though, they thought, oh, well, Rudy's had this bang out year. He's had 2 victories. We've paid him bonuses on those events. He's probably gonna want a big contract.
Justin Metzler:We don't want to double down and invest more or invest the same. We wanna diversify. Do you think there was maybe that conversation going on in the back, or did they not even give you an indication as to reasons why?
Rudy Von Berg:Not not really. I mean, they just said, yeah, budget cuts, the kinda, problems linked to COVID with the the bike industry. Yeah. Yeah. You know, they kept Sam, but Sam is worth quite a bit more than what they're giving him.
Rudy Von Berg:And he got just this minuscule increase. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, we're obviously I'm not gonna say numbers, but it's just, numbers that you'd think for Sam are just ridiculous at least in terms of the increase and probably his base salary as well. And then yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:So, I mean, they're just trying to cut budget and yeah. I don't know.
Justin Metzler:That's the stock industry. It's like the industry, response to any time that, like, they have yeah. Who knows? Like, I've gotten that conversation before myself, and it's never a fun one to have. Trek was always famous for, like, having really great on in, like, inter race or, like, race week support.
Justin Metzler:Did you feel that missing gap this year at all, not having that, like, at race help?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. No. Trek Trek, has always had usually at at the main races Yeah. And someone around for for tech and things like that. I I wouldn't say I really missed it because well, first of all, when I was still on my Trek this year, Mark from Trek would still help me if I needed.
Rudy Von Berg:So that that was really cool of him of him. Also, I just have this mentality that you have to be self sufficient, you know. Your bike has to be ready before you're traveling. When you know someone's gonna be there, you tend to do less at home because you know, oh, if there's there's these couple of things, he can just do it before the race. Sure.
Rudy Von Berg:But you're just a bit better organized in the end when you know if there's no support. So and also, you know, the t one hundred races, there's a ton of support there every race.
Justin Metzler:Sure.
Rudy Von Berg:So it was only a couple of races this year where there wasn't. But, but then in the end, yeah, I signed. I'm I'm I think you're gonna get to it, but I signed Factor and they had people, in Kona. So
Justin Metzler:Cool. Yeah. If you flip back through Rudy's Instagram, his new Factor's cool, but you had a really cool Bison paint job
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah.
Justin Metzler:On the track. So flip back and check that out. It's worth a, worth a look. Maybe you can talk Factor into doing something similar for a custom paint job, which you're probably deserving of. How did the Factor deal come about?
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, my agent has been working at it really hard, so ever since Trick dropped me, last year. And nothing really came about for 2024, at least, you know, at the end of 23. And but, you know, he was just staying on it and he just ended up, he he's been in contact with Factor as with many other brands. And it came to a point where he was talking to them in, August and, starting to talk for 2025. And then they didn't realize it was a possibility to for me to be on it already for Kona.
Rudy Von Berg:Mhmm. And, my agent, came to me and asked if it was a possibility. And I went through a lot of measurements. And with Nick from Wove, he helped me a lot with that, from the the Wove saddles. And so, yeah, we decided because I couldn't also my custom cockpit, I couldn't switch it over.
Rudy Von Berg:So I had to get a new custom cockpit. At that time, I was 8 weeks from Kona. I was like, I really need to get on the bike. I told him, like, 2 weeks from now, 6 weeks from the race, I really wanna be on the bike. Sure.
Rudy Von Berg:It ended up being only 4 weeks from the race. So a bit tight, but, the position was replicated almost. It was a bit short still, I'd say. Even though it ended up being quite okay. And, yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:And so we just signed, for end of this year and then another till end of next year. Nice. But, yes, we made it happen before Kona. They didn't think it was possible. But
Justin Metzler:Yep. And another it it seems abnormal in today's day and age to be having sponsors sign athletes midyear or in the Q3, but you also announced a partnership with TIR for running shoes pre Kona. Had you been testing those shoes? Was that something that you you mentioned on social media that you were gonna run-in them anyways. Is that the actual truth?
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Well, so they're they were in my top three favorite shoes because I've had a I was but we were potentially gonna sign a deal with T. E. R. Last year already at the end of 23.
Rudy Von Berg:It ended up falling through because, they were investing in a new warehouse in California. And so they just ended up saying no, which actually at the time was a bit of a shock too. So I was thinking at the time, you know, oh, I've had pretty much my best year ever. All my sponsors, you know, nothing's working right now. Like, this is weird.
Rudy Von Berg:Well, you know, if I'm performing, I should be seeing
Justin Metzler:some
Rudy Von Berg:sponsors. I also lost my French club at the end of the year last year, which was actually one of my top ones financially. So, you know, I lost my top two biggest ones pretty much. And then this tier one was gonna be quite good and didn't go through. But so, yeah, from then I have had the Carbon Chew.
Rudy Von Berg:So I've been using it, here and there in sessions for a whole year. And, you know, I compared everything, pace, heart rate, and all, and I could tell it was it felt good and it was fast. It was about the same as my other favorite shoes that I that I used in the races last year. So in, with July or August, I told my agent, you know, I could actually see myself racing Kona. So in the shoe, so we might as well try to make a deal because, like, I had to actually race it.
Rudy Von Berg:So, so essentially, that's what happened. And, yeah. I do really like the shoe. It's a bit, less cushioned. It's a bit more like the Asics
Justin Metzler:Sure. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:For example. Yeah. But it has a really good spring, you know, and it just feels good. So
Justin Metzler:Yeah. I mean, some of the shoes, like, I don't know if you need all of that cushion sometimes. And especially for these Ironman races, if it's too much cushion and you're start running you start breaking down your technique like When
Rudy Von Berg:you're tired? Yeah. Like the the Nike Alpha Flight does not work for me at the end of a marathon.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. They're great if you're running like 5 k pace or 10 k pace. Even for a half marathon, they're perfect. But like a marathon's it's slow in the context of what the shoe's made for, you know?
Rudy Von Berg:Right. And the tier still has a thick sole. So it's not, you know it's thicker than the Assix, for example. But, yeah. It's just a bit more firm and and springier.
Justin Metzler:So Do they have an entire line of training shoes and other options, or is it just their carbon racer right now?
Rudy Von Berg:No. So they have an entire line. There's also another shoe that's, quite good. It's it's pretty much the same shoe, but without the carbon plate. Cool.
Rudy Von Berg:But so it has that nice foam and kind of a a thick sole. And so that's kinda their, tempo, you know, type shoe. So that one's quite nice as well.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. It's always nice to have one. I feel like that's a gap in the market.
Justin Metzler:All these shoes are just going, like, carbon plate, nylon plate, or, like, a massive shoe that's just got all this cushion. And it's almost like, where are the shoes that were just that we had in 2015 that we all use? Like, sometimes I just go back to, like, a basic Pegasus or something.
Rudy Von Berg:It's like in Kona, some guys would use trainers. Do you remember Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Of course.
Rudy Von Berg:2015 because, like, well, all the ratios are just so minimalistic and light and light and light and
Justin Metzler:stuff. And stuff. Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. So you see guys with, like, gel, Caliano, or whatever. Like They just wanted, like,
Justin Metzler:a little bit of cushion. Yeah. I think we've come a long way since then. Yeah. Really cool.
Rudy Von Berg:I
Justin Metzler:have one more kinda topic here, before we get into the rapid fire to finish up the podcast. You just came 3rd in Kona. What does the rest of the year look like for you?
Rudy Von Berg:Yes. So I just have, the t 100 Dubai, the final of the t 100 series. So that's 3 weeks race to race. So 10 days from now. I'm trying to I've had that, in the past.
Rudy Von Berg:For example, this year, Roth to London was also full Ironman 2, t one hundred, 3 weeks in between. I feel like in the past, I'd rested too much after the Ironman and lost all the fitness. And, you know, and by the time I kinda started training again a little bit for the T100, it'd be kinda gone. So this time around, I figured I would kinda try to follow-up the race with some training, which, yeah, I don't honestly I don't know if it's working. I felt quite good.
Rudy Von Berg:I felt I was smashed the first two, three days, but then the next 5 days I felt pretty okay. Yeah. And, even did some intervals on the bike on Sunday, so 8 days after the race. And but then by then by after that I was quite tired. And then Monday, Tuesday, I had 3 workouts a day.
Rudy Von Berg:I mean, nothing big, but just kinda take over and I would do 20 minutes. Or I did a 25 100 swim one day and I was done the rest of the day. And then yesterday, I did the warm up of the run, less than 5 k, and I was just done. You know, like, my body just had nothing to to train, you
Justin Metzler:know. Yeah. And there's gotta be this mental component too. Right? Where, like, you've had this big goal.
Justin Metzler:Yeah.
Rudy Von Berg:Definitely. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:You've had a life accomplishment of getting on the podium in Kona. Obviously, there's more that you want, but there has to be, like, this kinda, like, post race depression type thing going on, in addition to
Rudy Von Berg:the physical side. It's a bit too bad. It would be nice to be able to enjoy more rather than think about another race. But also I'm, like, not stressing now about Dubai. I mean, maybe it was a little bit a few days ago, but now I'm like, you know, it's just, I mean, in the end, I know my season is a success and Kona was the most important.
Rudy Von Berg:I would like to have essentially have fun in Dubai and be in the pack or, you know, be racing for a top ten finish or something. That's my main motivator. And also, you know, 2 100 is a great series. You know, they've elevated the sport for professionals. I don't wanna be that guy that doesn't care and you know, doesn't train at all or doesn't even try.
Rudy Von Berg:Like, I'm trying to be in shape for Dubai, but it's just very it's gonna be very difficult for me, I think.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. All you can do is what you can do. So if you just go in with positivity and, try your best in training, like, it'll all work out the way it's meant to. What's your plan for next season and maybe the following season?
Rudy Von Berg:So for next season, I'm I'm tending towards, Iron Man Pro series. Yeah. I think it's just you you can't really do both t 100 and and Ironman. It's just especially for an athlete like me, I'm kinda need time to prepare for races and peak. If I don't peak for a race a race, like, okay, I can aim for a top ten, but it's gonna be hard to aim for a podium or win.
Rudy Von Berg:So I need to be in in somewhat of a peak for for big races. And, yeah, the only way to do that is to focus on 1 of the 2 series. And, t 100 would be even more racing than Ironman. Ironman is obviously full Ironmans, which takes more recovery and more prep and all that. But, yeah, overall, that's what I'm tending to.
Rudy Von Berg:And, you know, it's less travel and my girlfriend can we can probably go some races together and yeah. It's, yeah.
Justin Metzler:Are you gonna have to make a decision to decline a PTO contract? Because I believe you're sitting in 9th position in the world ranking.
Rudy Von Berg:No. So that's I think it's based it's based only on the t 100 only ranking. Got it. Yeah. So I won't get a a contract unless I crush Dubai, which is seems very unlikely right now.
Rudy Von Berg:So I'm I think I'm 16th right now. Okay.
Justin Metzler:So that makes it easier from a decision making perspective going into 2025. If you don't get a contract, maybe you can hop into a
Rudy Von Berg:race here or there on the ranking. Yeah. And for me, I mean, just how I've been brought up and Ironman, I can't see myself skipping an Ironman Worlds in Nice or in Kona. Like, so that has to be the highlight for me of the year. And if I wanted to, I have to qualify as well, because now top 3 in Kona or in the previous worlds doesn't qualify you anymore.
Rudy Von Berg:Yep. So that's already 2 full Ironmans. So it's already impossible to do that in 8 t 100, you know. Yep. So Will a full
Justin Metzler:will a win in Nice scratch the itch for an Ironman World Championship and you'd be happy with that looking back on your career, or will you need to win in Kona to be satisfied?
Rudy Von Berg:It's hard to say. I guess I'd have to do it to see how it feels. I mean, honestly, for me, I think it would be enough. I mean, all the guys are trying to win a Nice as well, as much as they're trying in Kona. We do have this thing in our sport about Kona being the just the top race, even above a Nice, which is the same race.
Rudy Von Berg:But, Nice might be a bit harder to win in a way because there's not those conditions that make some athletes better than others. Yeah. And, if you win there, like, yeah, there are less bonks and less meltdowns or overheating. So maybe potentially you could argue, yeah, you won even in a better way. And also the bike, less packs, more, more of a you need to be a more of a complete cyclist to crush that ride.
Rudy Von Berg:Watt per kilo, technical, and not much drafting. So yeah. I mean, from that, you could argue it's almost more legitimate.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Very cool. Alright. Well, that's all the questions that I've got before we finish with the podcast here with the rapid fire. You ready for the rapid fire?
Justin Metzler:I've got 7 questions today.
Rudy Von Berg:Mhmm.
Justin Metzler:Alright. Number 1, you're known for your elite descending skills. You've got a lot of the downhill KOMs here in Boulder. What's the max speed you've hit on a descent?
Rudy Von Berg:96 k's, not miles. That's,
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Yeah. 96 k per hour. Yeah. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:So that's, like, 60 miles an hour.
Rudy Von Berg:Yeah. Something like that.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. I think I've hit 60. So alright. That's good. Maybe we'll try to do as
Rudy Von Berg:It's hard to go much faster than that, though.
Justin Metzler:I know. You need, like, your a Tailwind TT bike, all your bottles full, and you gotta not give a shit.
Rudy Von Berg:You just
Justin Metzler:gotta be willing to go for
Rudy Von Berg:it. Yeah. And, honestly, I mean, I've I've never had a I'm gonna die on this descent mentality or take risks. Like, I know smooth is fast and in control is fast. Yep.
Rudy Von Berg:So I'm never really trying to get KOMs. But, now since my crash crash I know this is rapid fire. I'm not going.
Justin Metzler:No. It's fine.
Rudy Von Berg:But since my collarbone crash last year, I'm definitely feel a bit more, I'm a bit more careful and Yeah. Yeah. I still go fast on downhills, but I'm just, thinking a bit more of when where a car could be or just things like that.
Justin Metzler:Me too. Yeah. 100%. Alright. This is an audience question.
Justin Metzler:I asked Instagram yesterday. You can pick only 1. Kinder Bueno or Snapple.
Rudy Von Berg:Oh, that's Brian. Yeah. That's that's really hard. Oh, I can't pick. I cannot pick.
Rudy Von Berg:Snapple is the gold juice that will make you feel better in any situation.
Justin Metzler:Alright. Snapple got here. I think you just answered your own question.
Rudy Von Berg:Maybe. Snapple.
Justin Metzler:Alright. Number 3. Hot tub pre swim or hot tub post swim, and what's the optimal hot tub duration?
Rudy Von Berg:Hot tub has to be pre and post. People don't wanna do pre because they think they're gonna be cold in the water or something, but it's not, it doesn't work like that, everyone. If your core body is warm, you won't be as cold in the water.
Justin Metzler:Okay. So, and what's the optimal time?
Rudy Von Berg:Oh, 4 minutes 30 seconds.
Justin Metzler:4:30 pre and post, you time it out.
Rudy Von Berg:4:30 pre Yep. And, 8 minutes post.
Justin Metzler:That's pretty good. Yeah. That's nice because, like, you get warm, but you're not, like, sitting there sweating. Yep. Alright.
Justin Metzler:Do you consume bison, or is that, like, cannibalistic?
Rudy Von Berg:Occasionally, I consume bison, but, maybe I shouldn't.
Justin Metzler:Yep. What's the most difficult travel day you've ever had?
Rudy Von Berg:Most difficult travel. I mean, Singapore this year was I was quite worried about that one. Yep. It's a 17 hour flight, San Francisco, Singapore. And then also I remember some travels, to IT races deep in Mexico Yep.
Rudy Von Berg:Were very, very long. Yeah.
Justin Metzler:Like getting on some rickety bus or something from some airport 2 hours away. Yeah. I've been there. Alright. And, 2 more.
Justin Metzler:What is the first thing you look at when you check your phone in the morning?
Rudy Von Berg:First thing I look at, probably my WhatsApp messages. Yep. So since I'm 8 hours behind from Europe, I usually have stuff from my agent or maybe family group or things like that.
Justin Metzler:Europeans love WhatsApp. I was talking about that with someone the other day. Americans don't use WhatsApp, but everywhere else in the world, like, they love it.
Rudy Von Berg:But with triathlon, I mean, if you're doing, you know, you have sponsors and This is it's all international. So I use WhatsApp a lot.
Justin Metzler:Yeah. Me too now. I'm, like, all WhatsApp. You know? Alright.
Justin Metzler:Final one. Greatest triathlete of all time?
Rudy Von Berg:I'm not rapid fire is hard for me because I'm It's okay.
Justin Metzler:I'm happy to be here.
Rudy Von Berg:To be like all or nothing or things like that. The names that popped up were like Jan Frodeno, Dave Scott, Mark Allen, Simon Lessing. So yeah. That's what I'll say. Alright.
Justin Metzler:One of them. Cool. That's all the questions I've got today. Rudy, thank you very much for coming on the show.
Rudy Von Berg:Thank you, man.
Justin Metzler:Absolutely. Peace.
